Show notes
If the perfect bedroom existed, what would be in it? To explore the connection between bedrooms and sleep, we’ve invited interior designer Jennie Pritzker, for a deep dive into design, decor and the decisions that can make your bedroom an ideal place for sleep.
Episode-related links:
The Ultimate Guide to Menopause and Sleep
Why Are Women Sleep Deprived Compared To Men?
New Analysis of 30,000 Adults Shows Men Are Sleeping Better Than Women
Transcript
DR. SHELBY: How are you sleeping? Are you sleeping? I’m Dr. Shelby Harris, Director of Sleep Health at Sleepopolis, and this is Sleep Talking with Dr. Shelby, the show that dives deep into all things sleep so you can get the rest you deserve.
Today we’re discussing the perfect bedroom with interior designer Jennie Pritzker. But first, are you burnt out?
Everyone has periods of stress, but when that stress is prolonged, it can lead to chronic exhaustion, also known as burnout. So if you’ve been feeling more tired, more irritable, and more stressed, and you want to know if it’s burnout, try answering the following questions: when I wake up, do I lack energy for a new day?
Am I constantly exhausted, even after a full night’s sleep?
Do I feel emotionally numb to things I once enjoyed?
Am I getting sick or having headaches more so than usual?
Do I get frustrated more easily than I did before, even over small things?
If you answered yes to any of these, fend off that burnout by prioritizing yourself this week.
Go to bed earlier, you know I love that. Delegate some tasks at work, take a walk, or even redecorate your bedroom. Because if you’re burnt out, it can only make it harder to sleep. And before long, that exhaustion can impact your personal relationships, your performance at work, and your own health.
What’s your take on this, Jennie? How do you like to avoid burnout?
JENNIE PRITZKER: I was actually feeling very burnt out last week, and I said, I’m gonna take a walk, got myself a nice takeout lunch and I sort of pulled myself together. And I think it does work, just prioritizing yourself a little bit.
DS: If you like Sleep Talking with Dr. Shelby, take a second to follow or subscribe on YouTube, Spotify, or Apple Podcasts. It seems simple, but it helps us reach a lot more people to get them the rest they deserve.
If the perfect bedroom existed, what would be in it? To explore this connection between bedrooms and sleep, we’ve invited interior designer Jennie Pritzker. With a keen eye and a deep understanding of materials and art, Jennie has been designing spaces in Philadelphia and beyond through her own business, Jennie Pritzker Interiors, since 2013.
Using unexpected combinations, Jennie creates spaces that are beautiful and livable. And on a personal note, Jennie has been one of my closest friends since we were 19 years old at college. We’ve known each other for a long time and she has designed many of the rooms in my house to make them both beautiful and livable. So Jennie knows her stuff. I know this for sure.
Jennie, thanks so much for being here and welcome to Sleep Talking with Dr. Shelby.
JP: Thank you for having me.
DS: Jennie, let’s start with the idea of the perfect bedroom. You’ve reimagined and designed countless bedrooms, and I’m sure for different types of people with different types of needs and preferences and price points, do you think that the perfect bedroom exists?
JP: I don’t think that there is a perfect bedroom, but I do think that there are a lot things that people can do to make their bedroom closer to perfect for them.
And there isn’t one, you know, recipe for the perfect bedroom that would be perfect for everyone because everybody has different needs and different preferences.
DS: So actually, that’s a, that’s a good point. So when people come to you and they want you to design a bedroom, what sort of things do you hear from people, like what they’re prioritizing in their bedroom?
JP: A lot of times people are just saying, you know, they want to start fresh. They want it to be really nice. And a lot of times people don’t know what it is that they need to change about the bedroom. And so sometimes I’ll come in and say, you know, you could be doing this differently with the light. You could be doing this differently with the window treatments. You should take these things out of the bedroom. And then I just try to make it work for them.
DS: Okay. So when people come to you asking about bedroom design, do you feel like there’s been a shift in how people think about their bedrooms since maybe the pandemic? I mean, I’m, I’m in the New York City area. So a lot of people would have to have like a desk in their bedroom or like an office space. Do you find that you’ve had to do some of that stuff or did you have to do that during the pandemic?
JP: Actually, it’s funny, I feel like I’m undoing a lot of that after the pandemic.
DS: Really?
JP: Because there were a lot of people who were, like, my husband and I are both working from home, this was during the pandemic, and we have a home office, but now he has to sit in there and do his Zoom calls, so can you set up a desk for me in the bedroom? And I, I did that, like, for countless people.
And then, I think, after the fact, people are going back to the office. And I’ve been, you know, sort of taking some of those desks away or moving a desk into a closet or something like that, because I do not think that’s an ideal setup. The last thing I would want to look at when I’m trying to fall asleep or when I’m waking up in the morning is like a pile of papers that I have to address or my messy desk or some mail.
But it is an interesting shift. And I do think during the pandemic, people were in their houses all the time. People are still sleeping in their houses, but they’re not nitpicking every little thing in the house like they were a few years ago.
DS: Interesting. So when you’re designing a bedroom for someone, even if they don’t fully know what they want, I’m assuming people want their bedroom to be a place where they can relax, where they can hopefully sleep. What are things that you bring to the table or think about, shall I say, when you’re thinking about designing a bedroom for someone?
JP: To me, there are a lot of specifics, which I can go into. But the most important thing is that you walk into the room and you feel like this is a relaxing space. You walk in and you feel, ah, you know, I feel relaxed now.
And so there are a lot of different things that need to happen to achieve that. And of course, talking about a vibe is a sort of a non specific thing that you sort of have to know it when you see it or know it when you feel it, but it’s the most important thing. And so, things like a cluttered desk, like we just talked about, that definitely takes away from the vibe.
But I think, you know, a soothing color palette, a certain kind of a layout, certain kinds of materials can all contribute to giving it that feeling.
DS: So what would be, when you say a soothing kind of color palette, what colors would you necessarily like think of as soothing?
JP: I personally think that light colors are soothing and a soft color palette is soothing. I have on my walls in my bedroom, a very soft peach, which is not something that most people will go for these days, but it’s like a very relaxing color. A very soft gray blue, a soft beige, like I can see in your background. That’s an inviting and soothing color.
DS: So soft, inviting colors.
JP: Yes.
DS: I know you love orange.
JP: I love orange, but I wouldn’t put it in my bedroom.
DS: Not in a bedroom? Okay.
JP: Right.
DS: What about when we think about bedding for, for people and let’s also be mindful of different price points, right? Like, so not everyone’s able to go to a designer, right? What would you recommend for the kind of bedding that people, if people are really putting sleep as a priority, and they’re thinking about that bedding that’s comfortable, what kind of fabrics would you recommend? And where do you suggest people look? Because bedding can be really expensive.
JP: It can be. It can be crazy. What I will tell you from having worked with a lot of people is, number one, there are people who prefer a quilt or like a thin blanket. They don’t want anything heavy on them. And then there are people who love like a huge, heavy, fluffy duvet. And it’s totally a personal preference. I like, for myself, a fluffy duvet. And I also think you walk in and you see that and it’s inviting. I mean, I will talk about a layered approach to many things in the bedroom, but you could have like a coverlet and then you could have a duvet folded up at the foot of the bed.
I have done that for people. Then you have options. And I will tell you my favorite thing in terms of thinking about a great price point is with sheets. I have a favorite sheet, which is from Land’s End, which is a sateen sheet, and it’s really, really well priced. It was recommended, actually, on @thisoakhouse, which is a favorite Instagram account of mine.
DS: You turned me on to that account. I love it.
JP: It’s amazing, and she recommended these sheets, and Land’s End does 40 percent off. These sheets feel like they are percale or something really expensive, and they’re not. That’s my favorite cost-saving thing. But you don’t have to spend a ton of money. You really don’t. You can get a nice duvet at Ikea, you know, you just have to find the right things. But there are lots of things out there that are well priced.
DS: I think it’s interesting, I never realized that you go to Land’s End for sheets. So like, it’s huge.
JP: I know.
DS: So okay, it’s whatever is the most comfortable fabric for you at the price that you can afford. Right? That’s kind of where I always like to save.
Right.
There’s someone that I follow on Instagram and he keeps saying sleep is cheap. And I agree, like, not everyone can afford multi thousand dollar, you know, sheet sets and duvets and everything, and plenty of people sleep just fine on breathable fabrics, sweat wicking fabrics, whatever it is that works for them at a lower price point.
Are there certain fabrics, though, that you find are more comfortable that people really should be looking for, like, say, in the summer versus the winter, or does it not really matter?
JP: Well, I think with sheets, with regular sheets, not talking about cooling sheets or flannel sheets or anything like that, they’re usually either percale or they’re sateen. And I think that is a little bit of a personal preference. Like you could feel the sheet and see how does it feel to you. These sheets that I’m talking about that I’ve, like, recommended to so many people are sateen. But to some people that might feel, it’s like a little bit slippery.
DS: Mm hmm.
JP: And a percale feels more like cottony.
DS: Okay. And then what about with like lighting? I mean, there’s so many ways to darken a room. And I think people often think that that’s also really expensive. So what kind of suggestions do you have if someone wants to block out, they should block out the light, but wants to block out the light, like how could they go about doing that?
JP: Well, there are a few things. So there’s the light that you’re blocking out of the room, which I’ll talk about. And then there’s the lighting in the room. Which is another thing. So, the lighting in the room, I will also suggest a layered approach to this.
I am a huge fan of dimmers. I think a dimmer in the bedroom, if you have a dimmer in one room in your house, this is the room to have it in. As you start to wind down, you can dim the light down. You know, you don’t have to have like a bright light while you’re getting ready for bed. If you have recessed lighting, you can have that on a dimmer, and then people will have either like bedside lamps, or reading lights, or sconces and that’s the other layer.
So maybe eventually you turn off the overhead light and then you’re lying in bed reading and you have your reading light on. And that’s nice because it’s flexible.
DS: Okay. And then what about windows?
JP: So the light blocking is huge. And I will say this, like I’ve gone in to people’s homes and said, okay, you know, we’re doing your bedroom. All right, let’s do window treatments. And I said, do you want blackout? And you wouldn’t believe how many people have said to me, I don’t know, you know, I’ve never had that before. And I think it’s like a game changer. Everybody has slept in a hotel room where, you know, you close those draperies and it’s like you’re in a cave.
And I’ve heard drapery fabricators refer to that as actually like, hotel blackout. That’s actually a thing. Because it’s hard to achieve the total blackout in a residential setting because there’s often like, a sliver of light that’s sneaking in through the edge. So a lot of times I’ll do also a layered approach for the window treatments too. You know, you could have a blackout roller shade and then on top of it you could have blackout drapery panels that close and that way you’re covering that little sliver.
But to answer your question about cost, to get custom blackout draperies made to the size of your window is a splurge. Like, that’s probably, if you’re redoing your bedroom and you’re doing that, that’s going to be the most expensive thing in the bedroom.
But you don’t have to do that. There are other things that you can do. You can get a blackout roller shade from Home Depot. You can measure your window with your own tape measure and type those dimensions in on the Home Depot website and they will send you a shade that you can like hang up yourself. And that’s really, really inexpensive.
You can get drapery panels from Pottery Barn or from Anthropologie or something like that. In Pottery Barn, places like that will sell something that has blackout built in. So it really depends on what your budget is. If you have the budget though, to do custom, I do think that often is the best result.
I live in the city and my bedroom faces the street and when we got our blackout panels made I asked them also to sew in a soundproof liner and they did. You can get that, you know, if you’re getting something made just for you, that’s something else you can do.
DS: I had no idea that was something you could even get in drapery panels.
JP: Sound fabric liners. Yeah.
DS: Genius. And you find that makes a big difference?
JP: I think so. I mean, I’m not, like, my house, I can still hear the bus going by, but it’s quieter. It’s not perfect, but it helps.
DS: What about fans? So like a lot of people I recommend, like I keep my overhead fan on, but there are some designers who are like, I hate overhead fans. Like if someone needs an overhead fan, do you have recommendations for that? Are there good places where people can find more modern looking fans?
JP: A lot of fans are unattractive, in my opinion, but there are some really nice modern ones. Just simple, white, very plain, it almost disappears. That’s sort of, I would say, the desired effect. I’d rather not have the fan be a design element in the room.
DS: Yeah. I have a pretty minimal white one that I got at like Wayfair. Are there any other places that you recommend people go to look for fans if they want something that’s kind of minimal?
JP: There’s a company called the Modern Fan Company that I have used before and they make really, they make really nice fans.
DS: You know what you’re getting, modern fans.
JP: Yeah.
DS: Are there other things that you might do in a room to help dampen noise if someone’s like in a city that has a lot of outdoor noise that’s bothering them or causing awakenings? I mean, I think that it’s kind of like when you go to a noisy restaurant and sometimes you look around and you say, it’s so loud in here and then you realize like there’s not a soft surface in the entire place.
JP: I think, you know, carpeting your room, wall to wall carpet. That probably will make a big difference. I think the more soft surfaces you can integrate, you know, you’re probably not going to upholster your walls, but I think carpet can help.
DS: Is there a certain type of pile that you’d want to think about if you were getting, like, even, like, a big area rug or something?
JP: Not necessarily, but I would do something soft. You don’t want to step out of your bed onto, like, a sisal carpet. I don’t think that would feel very nice on your feet.
DS: Nice and comfortable. Okay. And then when you’re thinking about different age groups, whether it’s kids versus a college student, right? So like when they might have to share a room with someone, or have their own space, versus a 38-year-old. How do you think differently? How do you design differently?
JP: It’s an interesting question because in a way, you’re kind of doing the same thing for all of these people. But in a way there are things that you would want to do differently. So like a little kid, I would say the same way I would say to take the desk out of the room. I would not have, you know, tons of toys or Lego sets or things like that in there.
But also, like what you were saying before, I understand not everybody has a playroom in their house and maybe they have to keep all the toys in the kid’s bedroom. So maybe you can figure out a smart way to put them in the closet or put them in bins on the shelf. Because I do think the toys are the same thing as a messy desk.
And, you know, for a college student living in a dorm room, everything is there. I don’t think it’s good to have your computer in your bedroom, but if you live in a dorm room, you have to have your computer in your bedroom. So I guess you have to figure out a way to make it, you know, not a distraction.
DS: And are there things that people could do if they’re, say, in a dorm room that would not be permanent to make their bedroom feel more conducive to a comfortable, relaxing place?
JP: It’s very interesting. There’s a whole huge industry of dorm room decor now that did not exist when we were in college. And a lot of people are, interestingly, because you were ahead of the time, how you had your bed lofted when we were in college, a lot of people are lofting their beds and using them for storage, but they’ll have something covering up the bottom, a fabric panel, so you can’t see that there’s, like, all these things stacked and stored under the bed. And things like that, to sort of keep the clutter away.
DS: For listeners, I did not use mine for storage. I used it to put my grandfather’s BarcaLounger- if anybody is old enough to know what a BarcaLounger is- under there, so I could then watch TV. Okay. So that’s really clever, right, is to loft your bed a bit too, so that you can get the storage there.
What about like the walls, right? I mean, I just remember back when we were at Brown, like at least in the dorms that we were in, the cinder block walls, like that’s pretty cold and uninviting, like, are there things that people could be doing in there to make that feel better, other than posters all over the place?
JP: I know, which is not relaxing. I had so many posters. That was not relaxing at all. And that was not conducive to sleep at all. I mean, I saw something on Instagram. Recently, someone had put, you know, they came and they put temporary wallpaper up over the whole dorm room.
DS: Genius.
JP: Very labor intensive, but it looked incredible. It looked incredible if you’re willing to, you know, do a little work, I think you can, you can really make it look like an inviting residential space.
DS: Right. So yeah, think about how you want it to look, what would be inviting, because you’re going to spend a lot of time in your dorm room. And then, like you said, we talked about adults, like how we might want to design a bit different there versus a younger kid, but some of the basics, dark, quiet, cool, comfortable.
JP: Right.
DS: What about scent? Do you ever think about scent? Do people ever say like they want certain scents in their room, candles, aromatherapy, or is that something that they do kind of after the fact?
JP: I haven’t ever had anybody ask me about that, but it’s an interesting question because I’m not a big scent person myself, but I stayed at a very nice hotel last year where they had -one of the amenities that they had was this lavender pillow spray, which seems very odd.
And I sprayed it on my pillow, and it was very relaxing. I mean, that’s a very specific thing. I think some people might hate the smell of that, and it would not make them go to sleep, but if there’s a scent that you love that’s very relaxing to you, I think that could be a nice thing to integrate. Although I don’t know about candles or things like that.
DS: Yeah, I don’t really love scents so much, just as someone who has migraines and strong scents can give me a migraine. So like things like lavender, I have patients that swear by those sprays and lavender candles and all that stuff. But for me, it’s just, it’s too much. So I like to actually have a completely scent free bedroom as well.
Do you have any other tips or tricks for bedrooms that you’d like to share? Maybe something that you don’t get asked about a lot.
JP: Yes. I will say, the one thing is to think about nightstands, which pretty much every bedroom has. I think nightstands are really interesting because they serve a lot of purposes. People store things in them. Some people just want a very plain nightstand where they can just put like a book or an alarm clock or a glass of water.
It is an important piece. And the one thing that I will say about nightstands is that if you have two nightstands, they do not have to be the same. You don’t feel that you have to have a pair of matching nightstands.
DS: So matchy matchy doesn’t have to be the goal here, because I think a lot of people just get sets and then it’s just easier, but it doesn’t have to be that way.
JP: It can be, and it looks great, but it doesn’t have to be.
DS: And I think the thing to think about too is that a lot of people listening, and as we’re getting older, a lot more people are being diagnosed with sleep apnea, so they have their machine that has to go next to their bed, and so if you can have a nice place to put it even better. And sometimes I think about like, I have patients that will put it in drawers. Like if you get a nightstand that has a drawer, then you can put it in the drawer and then just open up the drawer at night. So you can then have a place to hide it.
JP: Right.
DS: So Jennie, we like to end with something to sleep on. So it’s one last point for anyone looking to change their sleep habits. So when it comes to everything that we’ve discussed today, do you have any final thoughts for our audience? Maybe something to sleep on.
JP: If you want to make your bedroom a better place for you to sleep, I would prioritize two things. I would find very comfortable sheets and I would think about getting light blocking window treatments. I think those are the most important things. If you can only make one or two changes in your bedroom, those are the two things you should do.
DS: Most bang for your buck. Yes.
JP: That’s great.
DS: Well, thank you again for being here, Jennie. I feel inspired to maybe reorganize my bedroom a bit because it needs it right now. And I bet that a lot of people in our audience are thinking about their bedroom and what they might be able to change as well. So thank you very much for being here.
JP: Thank you for having me. This was so much fun.
DS: Thanks for listening to Sleep Talking with Dr. Shelby, a Sleepopolis original podcast. Remember, if you’re tired of hitting snooze, hit subscribe or follow right now on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you’re listening. And for even more sleep tips. Visit sleepopolis.com and my Instagram page @sleepdocshelby.
Today’s episode was produced by Ready Freddie Media. Our Senior Director of Content is Alanna Nuñez and I’m Dr. Shelby Harris.
Until next time, sleep well.
